Trade Secrets

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Re: Trade Secrets

Postby hvered » 5:24 pm

More on hillforts. Hugh Thomson, an inveterate walker, wrote an article in the Guardian https://www.theguardian.com/travel/2017 ... -hillforts
in which he notes how 'completely empty' most of them are apart from dog walkers. Not my experience at all but each man to his own.

A good part of the article is devoted to the role of corvids, particularly ravens.

The raven has always been a creature of myth, for its intelligence, longevity (living 25-40 years, Tennyson’s “many-winter’d crow” had the life expectancy of any human in the iron age) and capacity to mimic or follow human behaviour. But not necessarily for its loyalty – a raven is not like a dog. Corvids are cunning, and capable of stealing from an iron age camp.


Perhaps something in TME (Thomson was sent a copy) resonated with him though we see corvids as extremely useful. (and the further we investigated, the more versatile they appeared). He does however come up with a rather splendid scenario of a priest or Druid sporting a raven on the shoulder a la Odin

Some ravens may have been domesticated by their Druid handlers, like the ravens at the Tower of London today. It would be an arresting sight, the priest with a large raven on his shoulder; for they are large birds, bigger than buzzards. (Such an image has been found at Moux in southern France, as a Gallo-Roman stone relief.)

His forthcoming book sounds like a worthwhile read. Pity about the publisher.
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Re: Trade Secrets

Postby Boreades » 11:18 pm

Some Vikings were Muslims, according to Al Beeb.

Why did Vikings have 'Allah' embroidered into funeral clothes? .. Researchers in Sweden have found Arabic characters woven into burial costumes from Viking boat graves. The discovery raises new questions about the influence of Islam in Scandinavia, writes journalist Tharik Hussain.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41567391


Is this in any way connected with Montgomery's assertion that the Vikings were happily pagan stay-at-home kind of guys until the Holy Roman Empire started trying to convert them. And then it all kicked-off. From then on, does "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" apply? Or would that be an ecumenical matter?
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Re: Trade Secrets

Postby Boreades » 11:38 pm

DNA research confirms the Irish Origin legends of Scotti?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFf_RQWaKV4
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Re: Trade Secrets

Postby Boreades » 11:57 am

Savills, those traders in plush pads, have got this palatial place on their books:

Templecombe House occupies a very special setting on an elevated site with a parkland setting with some tremendous and extensive views to the south-west towards the River Thames and Wargrave. The site also affords complete privacy. Templecombe House is a 20th century architect designed house built of stone and glass to a striking curved design. Large picture windows make the very best of the views and outlook into the gardens and grounds and well beyond. ... Originally forming part of what we believe to be a listed parkland setting, the Druids Altar is a collection of ancient stones that is Grade II Listed.


https://search.savills.com/com/en/list# ... shes170311

Strangely not mentioned in the estate agent's blurb is the dubious history of the Druids Altar.

Residents of Jersey have called for the return of the island's 'Elgin Marbles' monument that was taken and rebuilt in Oxfordshire as a governor's retirement gift. The dolmen - a large structure reminiscent of a stone circle which is built from slabs of pink granite - was discovered in 1785 in Mont de la Ville, near the capital St Helier. The Neolithic monument was uprooted and taken to the Oxfordshire estate of retiring Jersey governor General Henry Seymour Conway via barge three years later. The surviving ancient dolmen is now in the grounds of Templecombe House in Henley-on-Thames which is on the market for £7million.


Artistic licence or artful looting?

But be brave, mon ami!

It has given the residents of Jersey a new hope that they could buy back the stones and return them to the island. One local man named Neil Holmes is planning to raise £8million through an online crowdfunder in a bid to purchase the estate. He said: 'The aim of this is to buy the property that the neolithic Jersey dolmen currently resides on, repatriate the dolmen, then resell the estate.'


Sounds like a perfect investment for the TME pension funds.
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Re: Trade Secrets

Postby Mick Harper » 12:27 pm

Surely it would be cheaper to organise a liberation party. You organise the barge, Hatty will round up some toughs. I'll organise the ransom from the Jersey States. A repro would probably do but I've got no room.
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Re: Trade Secrets

Postby hvered » 5:42 pm

Aberfeldy came up although this time in a medieval context. There was a dig in 2015-6 which uncovered some stone remains said to belong to Aberfeldy's Dark Age past
Archaeologists working in the Glebe Field in Aberfeldy have uncovered the remains of an Anglo Saxon building which is one of the largest ever found in Scotland.

The find was part of a community archaeology project (led by Aberlady Conservation & History Society and AOC Archaeology) focusing on Aberlady's Anglo Saxon past.


They would say that, wouldn't they, though there is an element of uncertainty
volunteers uncovered what appear to be the remains of small cellular buildings, as well as a 20m x 4m stone feature which appears to be part of a larger stone building which extends to 20m x 40m, making it one of the largest Anglo Saxon buildings discovered in Scotland.


The leading archaeologist reveals the site, whatever its function, is a one-off
Ian Malcolm of Aberlady Conservation & History Society described the finds as 'Very, very exciting'. He told the East Lothian Courier that the site 'may have been monastic, or a feast hall or a royal site. There have been other excavations but no evidence of a structure on this scale has been discovered.'


One '9th century Anglo-Saxon coin' was found and two bone combs, one of which is dated '6th to 8th century'. Undeterred by the lack of finds, the archaeologists have pronounced this a major A-S site (twice)

A report on the Aberlady Angles website states that the excavation has revealed 'further evidence of an important and wealthy Anglo Saxon location'.

The latest finds are consistent with the dates of the largest collection of Anglo Saxon coins found in Scotland, which were discovered on the site in the 1980s, as well as the fragment of an Anglo Saxon cross found in the 19th century; adding weight to the theory that this was a significant Anglo Saxon site.

https://www.historyscotland.com/article ... st-lothian

So I wondered about Aberfeldy's earlier coin hoard and tried looking it up but there's no information about it. Does it exist, if so does it prove there was a thriving economy here despite the dearth of archaeology?
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Re: Trade Secrets

Postby TisILeclerc » 6:31 pm

Are you talking about Aberfeldy or Aberlady? Or about both places?
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Re: Trade Secrets

Postby Boreades » 7:03 pm

hvered wrote:The leading archaeologist reveals the site, whatever its function, is a one-off
Ian Malcolm of Aberlady Conservation & History Society described the finds as 'Very, very exciting'. He told the East Lothian Courier that the site 'may have been monastic, or a feast hall or a royal site. There have been other excavations but no evidence of a structure on this scale has been discovered.'



He would say that wouldn't he? All the usual suspects (high-status ritual elites and all).

On the other hand, it might just have been a warehouse or grain store?
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Re: Trade Secrets

Postby hvered » 9:13 am

it might just have been a warehouse or grain store?

Indeed it might but announcing the dig uncovered 'a major Anglo-Saxon site' needs explaining.

No-one seems to have questioned the mysterious disappearance of what's reportedly the largest A-S coin hoard found in Scotland, which perhaps never existed but such a claim couldn't have been allowed without rigorous checking, surely. How were the finds here dated anyway? Isn't it supposed to take months or even years to sift through and examine finds?

On the other hand it's a familiar scenario where Anglo-Saxon archaeology is concerned in England as well as, it seems, Scotland. The most famous A-S site of all, Monkwearmouth-Jarrow, where Bede is supposed to have presided, is a nothing sort of place as well. The leading archaeologist at Jarrow, Prof Rosemary Cramp, revealed the buildings were "very fragmentary" and "the evidence woefully inconclusive", due apparently to 'a lack of earlier stratification' or grave-robbing activity or border raids or..or...
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Re: Trade Secrets

Postby TisILeclerc » 12:23 pm

These Irish monks places are a funny old lot. A bit like the leprechaun's gold. It disappears when the sunlight hits it.

It's not just Jarrow, but Whitby as well. And Lindisfarne and even Iona. You'd have thought there would be something left of these places. After all there are plenty of stone monks' cells in Ireland. Assuming they were built by monks that is.

Time Team did a thing on Lindisfarne some time ago and were mystified as to why they couldn't really find anything. It can't be due to age as the Normans were able to build stuff that lasted and it's not much younger and there are Anglo Saxon churches still standing in various areas.

St Tony of the Trowels is involved in an organisation determined to find the Lindisfarne abbey.

He added: “Surprisingly little is known about the early monastery, and very little has been found from it, mainly a few scraps of broken masonry with poor records of where exactly they were recovered.”


https://www.theguardian.com/science/201 ... excavation

Perhaps the megalithics should start crowdfunding to raise a bit of cash as well?

Over on Iona Columba seems to have suffered the same fate in spite of banning women and cows from the island. He even buried his mate in the foundations to make sure the place would survive. But none of it worked. Apart from getting rid of frogs and snakes.

The strangest claim of all however is that Columba was prevented from completing the building of the original chapel until a living person had been buried in the foundations. His friend Oran volunteered for the job and was duly buried. It is said that Columba later requested that Oran’s face to be uncovered so he could bid a final farewell to his friend. Oran’s face was uncovered and he was found to be still alive but uttering such blasphemous descriptions of Heaven and Hell that Columbus ordered that he be covered up immediately


I think that Columbus really means Columba. Perhaps it is good old Oran having a dig at him from the foundations.

Although the Vikings attacked Iona the place was very well established and became the centre for the spread of Christianity across Scotland and northern England as well as the Continent. But it was Rome that finally did for them. A case of Blue on Blue or friendly fire or whatever they call it these days.

The Celtic Church, lacking central control and organisation, diminished in size and stature over the years to be replaced by the much larger and stronger Roman Church. Even Iona was not exempt from these changes and in 1203 a nunnery for the Order of the Black Nuns was established and the present-day Benedictine Abbey was built. The Abbey was a victim of the Reformation and lay in ruins until 1899 when its restoration started.

No part of St. Columba’s original buildings have survived, however on the left hand side of the Abbey entrance can be seen a small roofed chamber which is claimed to mark the site of the saint’s tomb.


http://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/Hi ... e-of-Iona/

So it looks like the Romans did for them all and no doubt destroyed their buildings and presence in the islands as if to show who was the boss.

Unless the Romans invented them as a justification for retaking Britain? Rather like the Soviet Union which was forever giving fraternal help to its satellites in the shape of tanks and soldiers. Rome comes to show Britain how to do it properly. None of this Irish superstition. We know a better one and we've got soldiers.
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