Megalithic mapping

[Boreades]

The Guichard investigations are most exciting, the number of Alesia-related names he marked on or near his lines are extraordinary.

Alesia came up in the Graham Robb book, whether independently or not I don't know, and according to Wiki there've been arguments raging over which Alesia was the location of Vercingetorix's defeat: "In total, around 40 towns and other locations have claimed to be the site of Alesia."

I'd be extraordinarily excited if we found a likely Alesia at 45 deg north.

[spiral]

The BBC have a nice summary on Alesia. It only goes to show how much easier it is to be skeptical about the others guys' parentage, rather than one's own.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19167600

"The "Jurassics", as the dissidents are known, are convinced that the original excavations at Alise-Sainte-Reine were deliberately falsified."

"Ferrand quotes a worker who allegedly told a reporter at the time that the finds were so amazing, "it was if they had been put there!""

"Some items are said to have been previously seen up for sale at auction, and there are questions over a chest of treasure that was supposedly found in the Roman lines."

"According to the Jurassics, this contained quantities of coins from different Gaulish tribes in exact proportion to their reported presence at the battle. How perfect, they say. And how unlikely."

Didn't Hats say all along the Vercingetorix coins were forgeries?

[Boreades]

@Spiral
Well found.
Here's their website

http://alesia.jura.free.fr/UK_accueil.html

[hvered]

I don't remember claiming Vercingetorix coins were forgeries though presumably most coins are a palimpsest, melting and remoulding them being as easy as correcting/altering a piece of parchment.

Not surprised to read about the 'Jurassics', the canton of Jura wants to break away from the rest of Switzerland. They claim to speak the purest French.

Finally got round to looking up Alesia which has apparently engendered a lengthy and still unresolved etymological argument. One side seems to favour a 'hydronym' breaking the name into Al- and -Is, the other camp prefers an 'oronym' claiming alaise means rocky place, cliff, crag, etc. My first thought when Alese places came up was "island-hopping" because of Is/Ys, but it seemed a bit far-fetched at the time.

Strangely, I was looking at Gaztelugatxe, an island attached to the Spanish coast half-way between Santander and San Sebastian, as part of an on-going obsession.



According to Wiki the name means something like 'castle on the crag' (the castle is in fact a hermitage dedicated to John the Baptist, a great Megalithic favourite):

The word gaztelugatxe comes from the Basque gaztelu = "castle" and aitz = "rock" or "crag", forming "crag of the castle".

which reminded me of the islets in the Thames known as aits so I wondered whether there was any connection between alese and axle, if the letters were transposed. Anyway, route-marking 'islands' might be seen as axles or axis [Aix place-names?].

[Mick Harper]

I don't remember claiming Vercingetorix coins were forgeries

No, I did. The question is thrashed out at noble length on the Matters Arising thread pp 211 et seq in the THOBR section of the AEL. Reading it again I am (as usual) impressed by my perspicacity. I am satisfied that all Vercingetorix coins (except perhaps one exemplar) are forgeries.

I have just read (or heard it on the telly) that the Vercingetorix statue at 'Alesia' is actually modelled on Napoleon III as a young man. Oh God, did I read it here? My mind ... never the most robust of vehicles ...

[spiral]

I don't remember claiming Vercingetorix coins were forgeries

No, I did. The question is thrashed out at noble length on the Matters Arising thread pp 211 et seq in the THOBR section of the AEL. Reading it again I am (as usual) impressed by my perspicacity. I am satisfied that all Vercingetorix coins (except perhaps one exemplar) are forgeries.

I have just read (or heard it on the telly) that the Vercingetorix statue at 'Alesia' is actually modelled on Napoleon III as a young man. Oh God, did I read it here? My mind ... never the most robust of vehicles ...

I have confused Laurel with Hardy. Apologies.

I admit to being impressed with this Vercingetorix coin hoax, its not quite as cool as the Lewis chessmen hoax but.....

[Boreades]

Finally got round to looking up Alesia which has apparently engendered a lengthy and still unresolved etymological argument. One side seems to favour a 'hydronym' breaking the name into Al- and -Is, the other camp prefers an 'oronym' claiming alaise means rocky place, cliff, crag, etc. My first thought when Alese places came up was "island-hopping" because of Is/Ys, but it seemed a bit far-fetched at the time.

Lys?

[Boreades]

According to Wiki the name means something like 'castle on the crag' (the castle is in fact a hermitage dedicated to John the Baptist, a great Megalithic favourite):

The word gaztelugatxe comes from the Basque gaztelu = "castle" and aitz = "rock" or "crag", forming "crag of the castle".

which reminded me of the islets in the Thames known as aits so I wondered whether there was any connection between alese and axle, if the letters were transposed. Anyway, route-marking 'islands' might be seen as axles or axis [Aix place-names?].

Which reminds me of the Welsh for ambulance = ambiwlans.

Anyway, the same Wiki page says

The small church dates from the 10th century and seems to have come from the Knights Templar.

which sounds like the Knights Templar were, there at least, keeping alive the art of beaconage. Probably also related to navigation to & from their main west coast port of La Rochelle.

"Coincidentally" both Sir Francis Drake and the Huguenots of La Rochelle both took a dim view of any Spanish control of Gaztelugatxe. Drake attacked and sacked it in 1593 and the Huguenots in 1594. "Coincidentally", when Drake returned to Europe on his famous circumnavigation, he stopped briefly in La Rochelle to unload part of his treasure of gold and silver, which was never included in the official quantities landed later in Plymouth. "Coincidentally" La Rochelle was the home of the Templar Fleet and their secret war against the Vatican Church.

[Boreades]

"According to the Jurassics, this contained quantities of coins from different Gaulish tribes in exact proportion to their reported presence at the battle. How perfect, they say. And how unlikely."

I know how they did that.

Roll up, roll up!
Come and watch the Gauls thrash the Romans!
For one night only!
Only one coin each!

Bring your whole tribe!
You might never see anything else like this ever again!
Roll up, roll up!
Only one coin each!

[TisILeclerc]

Guichard remarks in his book that many if not most of the Alesias are on peninsulas with a couple at least of rivers flowing around it but all of them are located at mineral water springs or wells. Source in French hence sourcier or sorcerer.

He is adamant that the names of all these locations are not French or Latin based and are found in all countries in Europe. They are pre Roman, pre Celtic and he claims that they are from a language dating back to the Stone Age.

We must ask the question why did these people turn up so early in Europe so soon after the ice age and did they already know about the mineral springs? What is the significance of that. Many of the local names refer to salt. Were they early salt traders and if so how did they know where the sources of salt were?

Is it coincidental that as well as this all these locations line up on their longitude line. And for that matter how did they work that one out? It took us long enough and these were people in bear skins wrestling with aurochs and things.

He does a basic analysis of river name elements among which are 'is, os, ous, etc.' As regards Britain that could explain Isis (the river not the madmen), Ouse, Tees and other rivers with similar elements.

It seems to me that these ancient map makers were everywhere and knew exactly what they were doing.