Megalithic shipping and trade routes

[Boreades]

Could those spirals be swarf?

If they were turning gold blocks for some reason there'd be a lot of swarf which they would collect for later smelting.

It certainly looks like swarf, but what kind of volume of gold would we be turning to produce swarf like that? It looks like it would be massive amounts. Not forgetting to wonder what would they be using for power tools and high-speed cutting blades/edges to turn gold at all?

[Boreades]

Could someone keep an eye on any orthodox explanations that are forthcoming? It'll probably turn out to be for ritual purposes.

Will do. But I think they are already trying to sneak in the usual suspects i.e. high status priests and ritual objects.

At the moment, my orthodox megalithic engineering explanation would be that it was work-in-progress (gold strips intended for gold jewellery) that got abandoned, lost or hidden.

[hvered]

Like TisI, my thought was the gold 'ribbons' could have been around something, a wooden (dagger?) handle perhaps, till I read they're only one inch long. It'd have to be mighty dainty, more likely to be ornamental than utilitarian.

A Daily Mail article just over a week ago suggests 'sacrificial offerings' and/or ornamentation. Interestingly, the location is already known as a gold hotspot:

They were not surprised to find precious gold items at Boeslunde, because the area has produced some of the largest gold finds from the Bronze Age in Northern Europe.
Six other large and heavy oath rings have been found at the site and in the 1800s, farmers found six gold vessels at Borgbjerg Banke, located 1,640 ft (500metres away) with a combined weight of 2.2 lbs (one kilo).

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3159152/Riddle-2-000-gold-spirals-Bronze-Age-springs-unearthed-Denmark-priest-king-s-costume.html

The gold-as-offerings seems to stem from a curator at Denmark's National Museum:
Flemming Kaul, a curator with the National Museum of Denmark, believes the coils are most likely related to prehistoric Bronze Age people who were known to offer gold to higher powers as part of sun rituals. ....... “The sun was one of the most sacred symbols in the Bronze Age and gold had a special magic,” Kaul writes. “Maybe the priest-king wore a gold ring on his wrist, and gold spirals on his cloak and his hat, where they during ritual sun ceremonies shone like the sun.” It’s also suggested the gold was simply buried as part of an elaborate sacrifice.

http://www.thisiscolossal.com/2015/07/archaeologists-unearth-trove-of-2000-mysterious-gold-spirals-in-denmark/

[hvered]

I'm wondering if there's a Phoenician connection because the legend of Zealand has many of the hallmarks of Carthage's founding legend. On the other hand, legend says that the land on Zealand was taken from Sweden and the gap left became Lake Vanern or Malaren. (It's common enough for excavated areas to be turned into lakes; perhaps it was in reality Swedish mining/metal-working skills that were transferred.)

A story told by the 13th-century Icelandic mythographer Snorri Sturluson in his Prose Edda about the origin of Lake Mälaren was probably originally about Vänern: the Swedish king Gylfi promised a woman, Gefjun, as much land as four oxen could plough in a day and a night, but she used oxen from the land of the giants, and moreover uprooted the land and dragged it into the sea, where it became the island of Zealand. Snorra Edda says that 'the inlets in the lake correspond to the headlands in Zealand';[2] since this is much more true of Vänern, the myth was probably originally about Vänern, not Mälaren.

Lake Vaenern is in Sweden but why on earth would it feature in Beowulf....

The Battle on the Ice of Lake Vänern was a 6th-century battle recorded in the Norse sagas and referred to in the Old English epic Beowulf. In Beowulf, Vänern is stated to be near the location of the Dragons mound at Earnanæs.

The village in Zealand, Boeslunde, was wealthy or important enough to have a 'very large' church:

Boeslunde church is a very large double nave gothic church from around the beginning of the 14th century – the building of the church ended around the 16th century. Around the beginning of the 15th century eight beautiful arches were built in the church. ..... The church lies close to Borgbjerg Banke which was a sacred place in prehistoric Denmark. Close by the church you will find an old holy spring, Helligkorskilde that people went on pilgrimage to.

Borgbjerg Banke is where gold arm-rings and bowls dated to the Bronze Age were found

The rich gold and bronze finds from this area are evidence that there was particular wealth there. Perhaps Borgbjerg Banke was perceived as a sacred mountain that reached up to the heavenly powers. The heavy gold rings were worn by the most powerful chieftains. Those who could sacrifice such valuable things must have been close to the gods.

Why is it claimed these objects were sacrificed? We bury valuable objects, in bank vaults generally, for safe-keeping.

http://en.natmus.dk/historical-knowledge/denmark/prehistoric-period-until-1050-ad/the-bronze-age/arm-rings-of-gold/the-hoard-from-borgbjerg-banke/

[Boreades]

Borgbjerg Banke

http://www.fredninger.dk/fredning/borgbjergs-banke/

[TisILeclerc]

Hvered:
'In Beowulf, Vänern is stated to be near the location of the Dragons mound at Earnanæs.'

There are lots of legends about heroes going into mounds to fight the dragon or the worm. Often the dragon or worm is guarding a treasure.

At the heart of the furnace is the salamander which is tapped when the contents are to be drained.

' On Saturday evening, the process known as “tapping the salamander” is expected to begin.

This involves creating two holes to drain – or “tap” away – a pool of residual liquid that gathers at the bottom of the furnace.

It is called the salamander by steelworkers because mineral elements in it create a particularly bright colouring.

After that, the furnace will begin to cool down. '



http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/5 ... k_restart/

This is a very old image which has persisted to the present day.



'The legendary salamander is often depicted as a typical salamander in shape, with a lizard-like form, but is usually ascribed an affinity with fire, sometimes specifically elemental fire.'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salamande ... and_legend

Here's how it's done today in a large furnace.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBLRIEZZEsU

It could be that all these tales about dragons were distant memories of the actual processes and terminology used by the ancient metal founders who themselves would have used picturesque imagery to describe what was happening. In a similar way in which computer terminology takes words already in existence and gives them a new specific meaning.

[hvered]

The phoenix is also traditionally said to be born in fire and returning to fire, yet rising from the ashes.

The founding myth of Zealand revolves around a goddess named Gefjon, characteristically depicted driving a team of oxen. Gefjun/Gefjon seems to be a variation of Freyja/Frigga even though a name ending -un is un-Scandinavian; nevertheless she seems to be one of the Æsir.

Somewhat reminiscent of St Ursula and her 11,000 virgins, not only Gefjun but all her attendants were virgins.
The Prose Edda and Heimskringla both report that Gefjon plowed away what is now lake Mälaren, Sweden, and with this land formed the island of Zealand, Denmark. In addition, the Prose Edda describes that not only is Gefjon a virgin herself, but that all who die a virgin become her attendants. Heimskringla records that Gefjon married the legendary Danish king Skjöldr and that the two dwelled in Lejre, Denmark.

The Carthage founding myth

Queen Elissar (also known as "Elissa", and by the Arabic name اليسار also اليسا and عليسا) who in later accounts became Queen Dido, was a princess of Tyre who founded the city of Carthage. At its peak her metropolis came to be called the "shining city", ruling 300 other cities around the western Mediterranean and leading the Phoenician Punic world.

Elissar was the Princess of Tyre, married to the High Priest of the city, who was wealthy and enjoyed widespread respect and power among the citizens. ....... Elissar fled Tyre with her husband's gold, and managed to trick the Tyrian ships sent in pursuit to join her fleet. When her ship was overtaken by the Tyrian ships, she threatened to throw the gold overboard and let the would-be captors face the wrath of her brother for failing their mission. They opted to join her, and the augmented fleet sailed on towards the West. Elissa eventually sailed to Africa after a brief stop at Cyprus, where she rescued 80 virgins from a temple. She requested land to establish a new city from the king of the Libyan tribe living near Byrsa after reaching Africa. Told that she could have as much land that can be covered by an oxhide, she cut the hide into thin strips and managed to surround the hill of Byrsa. The initial city of Carthage was founded on the spot.

[Boreades]

It could be that all these tales about dragons were distant memories of the actual processes and terminology used by the ancient metal founders who themselves would have used picturesque imagery to describe what was happening. In a similar way in which computer terminology takes words already in existence and gives them a new specific meaning.

I concur. We humans seem to have an never-ending desire to give names to animals, inventions, cars, boats and machines of all kinds. A smelting furnace at full blast, to any untrained observer, would seem like a fire-breathing monster. Especially at night, to the unitiated, it would be a fearful sight to behold. No wonder they could be called Dragons.



Hot, toxic, and dangerous to go near. The furnace supervisor, or the Dragon Master, or tales of taming the dragon, would becomes legendary stories. Lancing the dragon might mean the Dragon Master knocking out the plugs/gates/whatever to let the molten metal (the dragon's blood) flow into the molds. Taming or mastering the Dragon meant the treasure was found. Where was it found? In a foundry.

The tales of Celtic Saints going round killing the dragons might mean something else too. In Cornwall, the Stannary Parliament gives us one example of these metal miners and workers being a law unto themselves. Which probably didn't go down too well with a new power force (the Clergy) intent on being in control. Or local people seeing their countryside being deforested to feed the dragons' insatiable thirst for fuel.

Did the Celtic Saints forcibly shut down the trade by "killing" the dragons?

[TisILeclerc]

'Did the Celtic Saints forcibly shut down the trade by "killing" the dragons?'

They got rid of them in Ireland. At least St Patrick did. If we accept that dragons are also worms or wyrms as in the laidlie wyrm etc. Big snakes breathing fire.

'The Latin word draco, as in the constellation, Draco, comes directly from Greek δράκων, (drákōn, gazer). The word for dragon in Germanic mythology and its descendants is worm (Old English: wyrm, Old High German: wurm, Old Norse: ormr), meaning snake or serpent. In Old English, wyrm means "serpent", and draca means "dragon". Finnish lohikäärme directly translated means "salmon-snake", but the word lohi- was originally louhi- meaning crags or rocks, a "mountain snake".[citation needed] The prefix lohi- in lohikäärme is also thought to derive from the ancient Norse word lógi, meaning "fire", as in Finnish mythology there are also references to "tulikäärme" meaning fire-snake, or fire-serpent.'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_dragon

It's perhaps interesting that the Norse is 'ormr'. From which Great Orme in north Wales is named.

According to wiki it was called that by the Vikings but not by the locals for obvious reasons. It was called orme because apparently it looks like a serpent when coming from the sea. This name took root with the growth of tourism in recent years.

However the article goes on to tell us that there have been copper mines there since the bronze age.

'Large-scale human activity on the Great Orme began in Bronze Age with the opening of several copper mines. These were abandoned around 600 BC. Excavations show evidence that the Romans reopened the workings. In 1692 mining resumed again on the Orme. Ore was extracted until the end of the 19th century. It is likely that copper from the mine was exported to Continental Europe in the Bronze Age and Roman era. In addition to the three main mining areas, there are many open-cast bell pit mines along the lines of the main geological faults.'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Orme

So it could be that the Vikings were also referring to the smelting of the ore (oh dear not another ambiguous word?).

I wonder if Herm and Hermes are also connected?

[Boreades]

Ah yes, Ireland used to have a big copper industry, and some gold as well.

Modern Ireland isn't the first place I would have guessed to be "the largest zinc producer in Europe and the second largest producer of lead".

See http://www.mineralsireland.ie/Mining+in+Ireland/

Over the last 40 years a string of significant base metal discoveries have been made, including the giant ore deposit at Navan (>70Mt). Zinc-lead ores are also currently exploited from two other underground operations in south-central Ireland: Lisheen and Galmoy. The combined output from these mines, make Ireland the largest zinc producer in Europe and the second largest producer of lead.

How are they smelting all that ore?