Pub Crawl

[hvered]

A goat-saint seems very risque. Cavorting with a deer, specifically a hind in this case, has a more aristocratic and less pagan context. Interestingly, Gilles is said to have arrived from Greece though his cult is located in the south of France. The goat seems to be the animal most closely associated with Dionysus (Denis) perhaps because goatskins were traditionally used as wine bottles?

[macausland]

Goatskins also used for the bags in old bagpipes. Gaita, gaida etc. Many of these like the Hungarian pipes have little goats carved into the chanter stock.

Dyonisus would have been happy with the music and the wine.

[spiral]

'BehindTheName says Giles is "from Greek" and means 'young goat' though in art and in his legend he is associated with a deer.'

Giles.....Young goat..... You must be kidding.

[hvered]

This thread is spiralling out of control...but so much the better.

St Gotthard, a Bavarian Benedictine and Bishop of Hildesheim, became patron of travelling merchants, difficult childbirth, hailstones and lightning and those in peril on the sea. Hildesheim was a market town in Saxony on the Hellweg, or Salt Way. Gotthard or Godehard is translated as God-hard or 'divine strength' and for some reason his attribute is a dragon.

He is of course mainly associated with the St Gotthard mountain pass which was particularly dangerous in April and May (May 4 is St Gotthard's Day) when the River Reuss was highest. Wiki quotes a legend that involves giving a goat to the bridge-keeper when making the crossing, a very Megalithic and reasonable, if unpopular, practice.

The legend of this particular bridge states that the Reuss was so difficult to ford that a Swiss herdsman wished the devil would make a bridge. The Devil appeared, but required that the soul of the first to cross would be given to him. The mountaineer agreed, but drove a goat across ahead of him, fooling his adversary. Angered by this sham, the devil fetched a rock with the intention of smashing the bridge, but an old woman drew a cross on the rock so the devil couldn't lift it anymore.

This legend appears quite widespread, the Devil is constant though the type of animal varies.

[macausland]

I don't suppose he was the 'yodelling 'Gotthard'' of musical fame?

I thought the devil was supposed to be a goat as well?

[Boreades]

In honour of the thread title, here's a pub I visited last week in Brighton. I had hoped for a quiet family lunch, but I got "stoned" instead.

Druids Head, Brighton

Druid's Head, Brighton

DruidsHead_Brighton.png (230.9 KiB) Viewed 6494 times

The Druids Head takes its name from a ring of stones which were excavated nearly two centuries ago.

Sorry about the image quality, I have had to drastically reduce the resolution to comply ( maximum allowed size is 256 KB.)

[macausland]

http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/3519325

I've just come across Thirle Door at Duncansby Head in the far north east of Scotland.

Would it be any relation of Durdle Door in the far south west of England?

[Mick Harper]

Since they are both the same (extremely odd) thing and bear (extremely similar) names, it follows that coincidence can reasonably be ruled out. At the very least this points to a 'naming convention' that was common to the far south and the far north of Britain.

Since orthodoxy does not accept this possibility [unless thur- means 'rock' and dor means 'natural hole in' in proto-Celtic which seems a stretch even by the infinitely stretchable canons of the place-name industry] then we have here clear evidence of a maritime culture that was common to the whole of the British Isles ie The Megalithics. It is also of course strong circumstantial support for the idea that these 'holes in rocks' are artificial. Otherwise there would be no need for a special name for these features (we, for instance, don't have such a term).

[macausland]

In my other post regarding the Ferriby boats it is apparent that they were of similar design and make to the Dover boat which was unearthed in recent years.

So it would seem that boat building techniques were similar up the east coast. It is claimed that they could have been used to cross the north sea and the video of the replica shows a very powerful and fast boat indeed.

According to the Egyptian expert who visited Yorkshire he thinks there are even connections with ancient Egypt as the designs and construction techniques are very similar especially I believe with regards to the stitching.

Before 'Doggerland' went it must have been that the northern coast linking northern Britain with northern Denmark or wherever it was must have provided a shipping route. As the coastline moved further south with the increasing flooding there is no reason to think that people would have stopped crossing the sea.

Once 'Doggerland' disappeared forever the memory would have remained with the people on both sides of the new North Sea and I'm sure that would have ensured a continued contact from one side to the other.

[hvered]

I've just come across Thirle Door at Duncansby Head in the far north east of Scotland.

Would it be any relation of Durdle Door in the far south west of England?

Duncansby Head is the furthest north-east point of the Scottish mainland (not John O' Groats). The photo you posted up was taken from 'The Knee' which turns out to be a sturdy-looking sea-stack. From the south, Thirle Door is in the background.