Megalithic shipping and trade routes

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Re: Megalithic shipping and trade routes

Postby Mick Harper » 3:58 pm

Most valuable. It's not that I doubt your workings but I certainly doubt that anybody else has done it or anything like it. In fact, leave it for a few years, and you will read in every standard text book "Trading links between Britain and the Near East in the Anglo-Saxon period were plentiful. Even such everyday items as the caulking for ships was brought in from Syria."
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Re: Megalithic shipping and trade routes

Postby Boreades » 4:13 pm

Just noticed one of their footers:
"Samples from Great Orme (Llandudno), Windy Gnoll (Derbyshire), South Crofty (Cornwall) were analysed but yielded biomarker data inadequate for correlation purposes".

Given the large amount of sample material available from all three of these sources, I suspect this translates as :
"We cocked-up the analysis of three other British sources but we didn't go back and fix the problem; or do it again and get it right".

Which actually makes it eight known British sources (but only one fully used) and the results are even more skewed towards the "good" overseas samples.
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Re: Megalithic shipping and trade routes

Postby hvered » 4:24 pm

The tarry lumps, formerly known as Stockholm Tar, which are "produced by destructive distillation of wood from Pinus sylvestris L." have been sitting on the shelves of the British Museum since 1939 when Sutton Hoo was first excavated.

There is a detailed report on the latest findings http://journals.plos.org/plosone/articl ... ne.0166276 which entailed throwing everything at the stuff

Reinvestigation of the Sutton Hoo tars was undertaken within a wider research project examining the technology and preservation of ancient tars and pitches. The tar-like lumps were analysed by Fourier-transform infrared spectroscopy (FTIR), gas chromatography-mass spectrometry (GC-MS) and elemental analysis—isotope ratio mass spectrometry (EA-IRMS) and the surface morphology of the fragments was examined by optical microscopy and eflectance transformation imaging (RTI).


Diverse samples were compared though only from Britain and certain regions of the Middle East

One of the results from infrared spectroscopy might queer the pitch. Nevertheless it is still bitumen and not tar obtained from conifers as the BM had previously stated (in 2000)

The FTIR spectra of the putative tars 1939.1010.250 and 1939.1010.251 lacked the strong carbonyl band typical of pine-tar or tree resin, instead displaying less functionalised spectra, characteristic of bitumen. Spectra obtained from the other tarry finds were markedly different... and they share some features with reference spectra of cellulose and to a lesser degree Cassel brown pigment. The latter, as a bituminous earth, may indicate that these tar-like materials also have a fossil organic component, but the possibility that the spectra arise from contamination with soil-derived organic from the burial environment cannot be ruled out.


They took Shropshire as the most likely provenance though don't specifically mention the 'Tar Tunnel'

To constrain its origin, the chemical composition of the Sutton Hoo bitumen was compared with a select group of British and Middle Eastern bitumens. Bitumen from Pitchford (Shropshire, UK) was selected because of its long history of exploitation: the location is recorded as “Piceforde” in the Domesday Book (c. 1086) and the still extant bituminous well may have been used even earlier, as Romans at nearby Wroxeter are thought to have exploited local seeps. Other localities considered, that did not yield sufficient biomarkers for correlation, include mines at Great Orme’s Head (Gwynedd, Wales) and South Crofty (Cornwall), where anciently exploited ore deposits co-occur with bitumen. Specimens from three other on-shore petroleum systems (Windy Knoll, Derbyshire; Thurso, Caithness; Mupe Bay, Dorset) with substantial inland and coastal outcrops of vein-bitumen and bituminous sandstone were also included. The Middle Eastern comparators are all known or reputed to be in active exploitation in the 1st millennium AD and earlier

However despite ruling out the British connection, a Syrian provenance is not at all cut and dried

A larger comparator sample base would be needed to confirm a connection with a Syrian-bitumen family as above the more general Dead Sea family of bitumen. The potential impact of more than a thousand years in the acidic burial environment of Sutton Hoo should also be considered before closer parallels can be drawn with more specific sources. Alternative sources within the Eurasian continent might also be considered; bitumen trade between the Black Sea and the Mediterranean is archaeologically attested in earlier periods and although the source of this material is not proven its location on the inland river routes linking to the Baltic and North Seas may be significant. What is clear is that the Sutton Hoo bitumen does not correlate to any of the British petroleum systems investigated in this study.

Running out of options though it's not clear how Syrian bitumen was arrived at. The main source of bitumen, Canada, doesn't enter the picture.
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Re: Megalithic shipping and trade routes

Postby Mick Harper » 5:51 pm

Two passages that caught my Applied Epistemological eye were
Other localities considered, that did not yield sufficient biomarkers for correlation, include ...

Puzzling. If tiny thousand-year-old scraps can yield sufficient biomarkers for correlation (the whole basis for the experiment) what prevents these ones doing so?
bitumen trade between the Black Sea and the Mediterranean is archaeologically attested in earlier periods

Unless there is some other factor involved, this would appear to suggest that biomarkers were involved here too. If so, there would not be any base samples, and this is a case of a snake chasing its own tail.
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Re: Megalithic shipping and trade routes

Postby hvered » 6:35 pm

Syria may have been proposed as the source of the bitumen-tar not because of cutting-edge science but because of 'other items', not specified

The possible Syrian origin of the bitumen is particularly interesting given that other items in the burial assemblage have been linked to this region. Nevertheless, the significance of the bitumen lumps among the grave goods is not clear as their morphology offers little evidence for their original form: possibly they represent surviving components of perishable objects, fragmentary small bitumen objects or, alternatively, the material may have been valued in its own right as a prestige raw material.

All the analysis, crushing, zapping and erudite terminology are inconclusive as far as dating is concerned. The problem is they have no idea how long this stuff was in the ground.

The use of bitumen in the 12th century BC seems to be better documented than for the Sutton Hoo era.
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Re: Megalithic shipping and trade routes

Postby Boreades » 2:58 pm

hvered wrote:The use of bitumen in the 12th century BC seems to be better documented than for the Sutton Hoo era.


Yes, and it's also documented in Roman Britain (and before)

The Kimmeridge oil shale was used for making armlets in Iron Age and Roman times and this industry was on a substantial scale. Objects of Kimmeridge oil shale have been found on the continent, as far away as Switzerland. ... The Kimmeridge oil shale was used extensively by Iron Age British tribesmen and the Romans for armlets. These were made on a primitive lathe. The residual central disks are known as Kimmeridge coal money. Large numbers have been found. With one of them is shown a beach pebble of oil shale that I polished with carborundum paper and metal polish. This gives an idea of the polished appearance. It is easy to polish and the material seems to have been much valued in antiquity.
http://www.southampton.ac.uk/~imw/Kimme ... tm#KOS-2-1


Image

See also http://www.dorsetgeologistsassociation. ... _Vol_1.pdf

Kimmeridge oil shale gets its name from that part of Dorset. But that is just the southernmost tip of a layer of geology that curves in a northern and north-easterly direction through much of southern Britain, across to East Anglia, and then northwards through Tisi-territory and up to Scotland. And, of course, out under the North Sea.

And our Elizabethans cashed in on it too.

In the 17th century Sir William Clavell, owner of the land around Kimmeridge, used the Kimmeridge oil shale as fuel for glass-making, and for boiling sea-water to manufacture salt.
http://www.ukogplc.com/page.php?pID=72


The Clavell family appears to have similarities to the Drakes

John Clavell's descendant Sir William Clavell (1568–1644) earned his knighthood fighting in Ireland for Elizabeth I against the Earl of Tyrone. On his return to England he engaged in various projects to exploit the oil shale found in the cliffs near Kimmeridge. Initially he attempted the production of alum, but this infringed on a monopoly granted by James I, and his works were confiscated. He then set up works for the production of glass and salt, using the shale as fuel. The chief disadvantage of burning shale was the smell - one of Clavell's neighbours compared it to a "close stool". In order to be closer to — but upwind of — these works Sir William set about building a new house at Smedmore. However, along with the losses incurred from his alum works, this proved to be ruinously expensive and he ran up debts of some £20,000. He was therefore forced to sell much of the land he had inherited, including Barneston


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smedmore_House
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Re: Megalithic shipping and trade routes

Postby Boreades » 8:22 pm

Mick Harper wrote: But since earthquakes nowadays are mainly (wholly?) the result of fracking and not plates moving, (wherever both are a possibility) this causal connection is splitting apart at the seams. Not that geologists have noticed. Nor pretty much anyone else it would seem.


Hmm, my mind must be dimming, but it's still not clear what you think caused earthquakes before we started fracking.
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Re: Megalithic shipping and trade routes

Postby Mick Harper » 1:31 am

You remember the AE rule? Same outcome, same cause. Now just inject water on a larger scale.
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Re: Megalithic shipping and trade routes

Postby Boreades » 11:43 pm

Britain's oldest known harbour (Poole) is officially dated to 2,267 years old

Poole Harbour is Britain's oldest working cross-channel port, according to new research. Archaeologists say ancient piles - wooden supports - found within a series of jetties at the harbour, date back to 250 BC. The work was carried out by experts from Bournemouth University and the Poole Bay Archaeological Research group. Two jetties have been found so far, one projecting south west from Green Island and the other north east from Cleavel Point.

Artefacts from the Iron Age settlement at Cleavel Point shows that traders sailed into Poole Harbour at the time to purchase pottery, shale jewellery and other things made locally in Dorset. Professor Tim Darvill, head of Bournemouth University's Archaeology and Historic Environment Group, said: "The scale of the facilities now revealed around Cleavel suggests that here is Britain's first really substantial cross-channel port.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2266789.stm


The jetties are at Green Island, Poole, Dorset (Durotriges territory), in between Maiden Castle and Hengistbury Head. But these pre-Roman jetties turns out to be an anomaly as well.

A series of 25cm diameter oak posts were rammed into the river bed, then infilled with hard Purbeck limestone to form a hard jetty.


Why? The experts who have dug up and examined this are flummoxed.

There's nothing like it anywhere on the Atlantic Coast. To find anything comparable you'd really have to go to the Mediterranean world, the Greeks and the Romans. What surprises me is the amount of investment that's gone into constructing something like this.

Archaelogists believe that an iron age trading network extended all the way from Britain as far as India. The Ower peninsula has extensive evidence of iron age industry.

Why on Green Island? When we look at the trading islands in the Mediterranean occupied by the Greeks and the Phoenicians, and places like Cadiz, they're on islands.


Falling out of the cliff on the north side of the island, they found pottery and large lumps of iron slag and furness lining.

Hmmm, who do we know who could or would build anything in a Mediterranean (pre-Roman) style in darkest Britain? Then start smelting iron, exporting ironware, pottery, shalestone ornamental rings, etc.

See St.Tony and his brethren : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUSGBqgrteA
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Re: Megalithic shipping and trade routes

Postby hvered » 9:53 pm

Just watched the Time Team on Green Island to which Borry kindly provided a link. Among the iron and shale detritus they dug up shale bracelets, or armlets, and then replicated the manufacturing process. Assumed to be an ornament, it was presented to the island's owner as a thank you.

But the armlets looked plain and functional, almost identical to the slave rings in Reading's Museum of Rural Life. The furnace the team found may have been manned by slaves, or could the island itself have been a holding place? It's certainly well situated, within sight of the main harbour but only accessible by boat.
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