Jack and the Beanstalk

[Boreades]

Moors, bells, darkened faces it is mining.

Err, sorry, the connection eludes me. Why would you be Morris Dancing in a mine?

[macausland]

Boreades

I think the Bacup coconut dancers black up because when they were miners they were usually black from the coal dust when they did their dances, in the street not the mine of course.

[Boreades]

Boreades

I think the Bacup coconut dancers black up because when they were miners they were usually black from the coal dust when they did their dances, in the street not the mine of course.

These?

History of the coconutters, from their leaflet

They begin at 9 a.m. from the Travellers' Rest Pub on the A671 Rochdale to Bacup road, culminating with an exhibition in the town centre amongst throngs of people that have gathered creating a festive atmosphere at approximately 1 to 2 p.m., finally ending at about 6-7 p.m. with a dance at the old folks' bungalows at the boundary before entrance to the Glen on the A681.

The first Coconutters troup was formed in 1857 and the Britannia Coconutters are unique as the only surviving troupe practising this kind of dance in this country and maybe in the world, out of four or five troupes that once prevailed in the Rossendale area.
The dances (5 garland dances and 2 nut dances) are supposed to be pirate dances brought to Cornwall by Moorish pirates who settled there and became employed in the mining industry. As mines and quarries opened in Lancashire in the 18th and 19th centuries some of these men moved north, bringing with them their expertise in mining, and of course the dances.

The Garland dances (each dancer carries an arched garland decorated with red, white and blue flowers) are Spring ritual dances of Pagan or Mediaeval origin, celebrating the coming of Spring and renewal of vegetation. The dancers black their faces to prevent them being recognised by the evil spirits afterwards; this may also reflect the mining connections.

The Coconut dances are unique. The dancers tap out rhythms on wooden discs or 'nuts' fastened to their palms, knees and waist (said to represent the protective cover worn on the hands and knees when crawling along narrow passages in the mines). The origin of the dances has not been traced, but it is known they were performed in feudal times. Their usual accompaniment is the English concertina.

Very nice, but strange that the same dance doesn't persist in Cornwall. Or does it? Any chance that this is where we get "he's a nutter" from?

[macausland]

Boreades

That's them. But I can't see Moorish pirates giving up a life on the ocean wave to become honest toilers in a Cornish mine and then moving north.

There were however Barbary slave traders active in the area for a long time. They were finally stopped I believe by the Americans who destroyed their base after attacking American ships. I think that was about the time of the Napoleonic wars.

Medieval concertinas?

Variations of Morris dancing were known in many parts of Europe so I doubt if 'Moors' had anything to do with that. It's probably a bit of 'folk' etymology.

Why is it called 'Morris' dancing? Because it came from the Moors. Some theories say that it was brought back by the Crusaders but I can't see why returning soldiers would want to bring back a dance they saw their enemies doing.

I think it's part of a long tradition as we can see by the examples in the Basque country and Portugal. It would be interesting to find where else this kind of dance is performed to see what the pattern is.

Quite often these dances are performed as part of a ritualised play where St. George appears as well as a Fool and a Doctor. I think the Doctor brings the dragon back to life at the end of the dance.

Of course there are the various hobby horse dances from Cornwall and Devon. These are very ritualistic and there is always a band of companions with the horse who appear to be rather malevolent dragging spectators in from the crowd to dance with the horse.

[spiral]

I think the Bacup coconut dancers black up because when they were miners they were usually black from the coal dust when they did their dances, in the street not the mine of course.

The assumption that Sword or Rapper dance is a form of Morris dance is wrong, the Morris (moors) dance is a form of sword dance. This is about moors, metal, megaliths and mineworking.

[hvered]

Quite often these dances are performed as part of a ritualised play where St. George appears as well as a Fool and a Doctor. I think the Doctor brings the dragon back to life at the end of the dance.

Of course there are the various hobby horse dances from Cornwall and Devon. These are very ritualistic and there is always a band of companions with the horse who appear to be rather malevolent dragging spectators in from the crowd to dance with the horse.

Topsy-turvy days are when the underground workers are free to take over above ground, seemingly limited to a specific day and place (the Bacup lot stay strictly within their boundaries).

The hobby horse could be a version of a pit pony which needed to be escorted because working underground affected the animal's eyesight. The ponies may have been valuable enough to be cared for but presumably not much can be done to restore sight. {Water from 'holy' springs and wells was often associated with curing eye problems}. Horses became extremely valuable in military terms, it's interesting in this context that the finest horses were Arab (from north Africa?) with or without steroids.

In medieval times miners could be relied on to assist in military campaigns, literally undermining an enemy's redoubt. There's an even longer connection with hunting, digging pits and underground traps.

[macausland]

hvered

I think I'd agree with Spiral on the moors' dance origin of the Morris dance.

They are the dances of the moors where the deer and the hunting folk play. Perhaps they represented a shamanistic pre hunt ritual or perhaps a teaching method for younger members of the troup/troop so that they would be better prepared for the actual hunt. The British army once had drills such as pike drills performed to music. This was to get the co-ordination right etc. It would also help to bond the hunters and develop the 'group ethic' or team spirit as we like to say these days. The video of the Portugese dancers leaping over the 'tower' shows the amount of trust needed by the participants that their fellow dancers will be there to help. Perhaps it was also a technique meant to confuse a charging animal and attack it from behind.

I think Arab horses came from Arabia itself although the Austrian 'Spanish' school of horse riding is based on horse skills from Spain. I assume that the horses were brought to Spain during the Arab invasion. The Camargue area of France is famous for its horses.

As for Britain. I think that all our horses are on the small side. From pit ponies to Shetland ponies, Exmoor ponies and the highland garrons that the clan chiefs rode about on. They tended to be for getting about on rough ground I think rather than for warfare, or for transporting goods. Deer hunters in the highlands still use them for carrying the carcases back down the mountain.

As for miners. They seem to have been a superstitious lot, for good reason I suppose. There are many tales and songs of miners meeting the devil while underground and how he is tricked by the canny workers. Perhaps we could draw parallels between miners and hunters? Miners have to find the seams and follow them wherever they go, all in the dark, and then chop the coal or whatever out and take it home.

[Martin]

About the only thing that grows in Scotland is oats. About the only thing I know about horses is they eat oats for energy. Do you think oats might have been cultivated for horses rather than people?

[macausland]

Martin

As the song goes,

' Mairzy doats and dozy doats and liddle lamzy divey
A kiddley divey too, wouldn't you?'

I think Sheila MacGregor deals with that one. Without looking I think she believes that oats were introduced to Scotland because of the increasing control by landowners over the food supply for ordinary people. I may be wrong on that one and if so many apologies.

I think you will find that many things grow in Scotland, even trees despite rumours to the contrary.

[Chad]

The dances (5 garland dances and 2 nut dances) are supposed to be pirate dances brought to Cornwall by Moorish pirates who settled there and became employed in the mining industry. As mines and quarries opened in Lancashire in the 18th and 19th centuries some of these men moved north, bringing with them their expertise in mining, and of course the dances.

No, this can’t be correct.

I live uncomfortably close to the Rosendale valley and can guarantee Bacup has not seen an influx of new genetic material since Megalithic times (barring recent incomers from the sub-continent)… the locals are as inbred as it is possible to become.

Anything that loosely passes as culture or tradition in Bacup is likely to be unchanged since the Mesolithic.